Another mass shooting

[RainbowsandUnicorns]

Theres been plenty of times where a good guy with a gun stopped a bad guy

"Plenty"? I don't know. Maybe.
What I do know is there have been more times when a bad guy with a gun killed a good guy. With or without a gun. You do know the "bad guy" in Louisville shot "good guys" who had guns. Right?

[RainbowsandUnicorns]

That looks like a happy healthy family with a safe and secure household. Maybe instead of whining you should strive to be more like them

The day I strive to be "more like" Massie and his family is the day I blow my own head off with a gun.

[jfish26]

Exactly. I bet they wish they were armed and allowed to defend themselves. Instead we put them in a gun free zone like easy targets for the mentally unstable

“The armed adults couldn’t prevent it. The only solution is OBVIOUSLY to arm the children, too.”

Thats a really dumb statement. Everytime there is an active school shooter how do we stop it? We send in men with guns. And it does save lives

And SOMETIMES those men even go in!

The very first thing that responsible adults would do, is to prevent mass shootings from occurring so often in the first place. It’s absolutely absurd to say that reducing easy access to assault weapons would NOT reduce the number of people shot to death with assault weapons.

(It’s here I will note, also, that reducing easy access to assault weapons would BY NO MEANS stop us from ALSO having more armed guards, hardening entry/exit points, and so on.)

[randylahey]

That looks like a happy healthy family with a safe and secure household. Maybe instead of whining you should strive to be more like them

The day I strive to be "more like" Massie and his family is the day I blow my own head off with a gun.

Youre scared to use guns that'll never happen

[jfish26]

Under Randy’s logic, the American Cancer Society would release new lung cancer prevention guidelines that call for people to reduce their exposure to second hand smoke, their exposure to radon/asbestos, to improve their diets and exercise more…but keep right on with those four packs/day.

[randylahey]

Under Randy’s logic, the American Cancer Society would release new lung cancer prevention guidelines that call for people to reduce their exposure to second hand smoke, their exposure to radon/asbestos, to improve their diets and exercise more…but keep right on with those four packs/day.

Nope. That's a horrible reach. You tend to do that when you've got nothing reasonable to say

[randylahey]

What these shootings truly are is a desperate cry for help. An act of vengeance and attention for these mentally unstable lost souls that feel they don't fit into society and want to remind us that they are still here.

And then we cater to that. The media gives them infamy and endless attention for a short time while the situations are politically exploited.

One simple step I would think is to stop giving them the attention they are after. Stop inspiring the next shooter. Let them die nameless and their names forgotten

[jfish26]

Under Randy’s logic, the American Cancer Society would release new lung cancer prevention guidelines that call for people to reduce their exposure to second hand smoke, their exposure to radon/asbestos, to improve their diets and exercise more…but keep right on with those four packs/day.

Nope. That's a horrible reach. You tend to do that when you've got nothing reasonable to say

Under your logic, the Department of Transportation would mandate blind spot sensors, posted motorcycle awareness signs, improved head trauma protocols at ERs, designated motorcycle lanes…but not helmets.

[jfish26]

What these shootings truly are is a desperate cry for help. An act of vengeance and attention for these mentally unstable lost souls that feel they don't fit into society and want to remind us that they are still here.

And then we cater to that. The media gives them infamy and endless attention for a short time while the situations are politically exploited.

One simple step I would think is to stop giving them the attention they are after. Stop inspiring the next shooter. Let them die nameless and their names forgotten

One simple step to reduce the number of children turned into hamburger meat by AR-15s would be to make AR-15s harder to get.

[RainbowsandUnicorns]

Rainbows you don't own a gun correct? What would you do in the event of a home intruder? What would be your plan if someone broke into your house at night with ill intent

A. Correct. I don't own a gun.

B. I am 56 years of age. To the best of my knowledge, I have had just one attempted "home intruder" in my lifetime. That person didn't have "ill intent" unless her being drunk and thinking she was going in to her own apartment was "ill intent".
Now if I had a gun and mistakenly thought she was trying to harm me and I shot her and killed her.....
Do you think that would have been a better outcome for both her and I than what happened?

C. Just like I did in "B." If I heard someone attempting to break in to my home I would first question the person. If the person continued to try and get in my home I would tell them I had a gun and the police were on the way.

D. I live in a semi secure building with 24 hour security. That doesn't mean someone can't break in to my apartment and kill me if they wanted to but thankfully I'm so far so good in that regard.
If I didn't hear a person entering my home and that person shot and killed me, oh well. Shit happens.
I'd rather take my chances of that happening then my shooting someone who wanted nothing from me other than some of my material possessions.

E. Right or wrong, I truly believe if I had a gun and someone else had a gun, they would probably shoot me before I shot them. If I didn't threaten them with a gun, and I believe the chances would be less that they would shoot me.

F. I have considered legally owning a gun. I have weighed the pros and cons. For me, the cons outweigh the pros.
I have ZERO problem with those who LEGALLY own what I consider to be "reasonable" guns and who feel the pros outweigh the cons for them.
I have a BIG problem with how easy it is for BOTH "bad guys" and "good guys" to obtain ALL KINDS of guns BOTH legally and illegally and feel there should be stronger/tougher/better laws and regulations in regards to it.

[RainbowsandUnicorns]

That looks like a happy healthy family with a safe and secure household. Maybe instead of whining you should strive to be more like them

The day I strive to be "more like" Massie and his family is the day I blow my own head off with a gun.

Youre scared to use guns that'll never happen

I have "used" a gun. I wasn't scared. Granted, I would probably be "scared" to shoot myself.
That being said, I'm a hell of lot more scared of becoming "more like" Massie than I am to use a gun.

[randylahey]

What these shootings truly are is a desperate cry for help. An act of vengeance and attention for these mentally unstable lost souls that feel they don't fit into society and want to remind us that they are still here.

And then we cater to that. The media gives them infamy and endless attention for a short time while the situations are politically exploited.

One simple step I would think is to stop giving them the attention they are after. Stop inspiring the next shooter. Let them die nameless and their names forgotten

One simple step to reduce the number of children turned into hamburger meat by AR-15s would be to make AR-15s harder to get.

How ignorant do you have to be to still think that someone that doesn't abide by already established far more serious laws, is going to abide by a new law

If life in jail for murder didn't deter them. How is your little baby hurdle going to change anything

[jfish26]

Rainbows you don't own a gun correct? What would you do in the event of a home intruder? What would be your plan if someone broke into your house at night with ill intent

A. Correct. I don't own a gun.

B. I am 56 years of age. To the best of my knowledge, I have had just one attempted "home intruder" in my lifetime. That person didn't have "ill intent" unless her being drunk and thinking she was going in to her own apartment was "ill intent".
Now if I had a gun and mistakenly thought she was trying to harm me and I shot her and killed her.....
Do you think that would have been a better outcome for both her and I than what happened?

C. Just like I did in "B." If I heard someone attempting to break in to my home I would first question the person. If the person continued to try and get in my home I would tell them I had a gun and the police were on the way.

D. I live in a semi secure building with 24 hour security. That doesn't mean someone can't break in to my apartment and kill me if they wanted to but thankfully I'm so far so good in that regard.
If I didn't hear a person entering my home and that person shot and killed me, oh well. Shit happens.
I'd rather take my chances of that happening then my shooting someone who wanted nothing from me other than some of my material possessions.

E. Right or wrong, I truly believe if I had a gun and someone else had a gun, they would probably shoot me before I shot them. If I didn't threaten them with a gun, and I believe the chances would be less that they would shoot me.

F. I have considered legally owning a gun. I have weighed the pros and cons. For me, the cons outweigh the pros.
I have ZERO problem with those who LEGALLY own what I consider to be "reasonable" guns and who feel the pros outweigh the cons for them.
I have a BIG problem with how easy it is for BOTH "bad guys" and "good guys" to obtain ALL KINDS of guns BOTH legally and illegally and feel there should be stronger/tougher/better laws and regulations in regards to it.

My shotguns can only hold three shells at a time. Because federal law governing migratory bird (ducks, geese, etc.) hunting imposes that limitation (and has for generations). And yet, our country has not fallen to the British THAT ENTIRE TIME.

[RainbowsandUnicorns]

What these shootings truly are is a desperate cry for help. An act of vengeance and attention for these mentally unstable lost souls that feel they don't fit into society and want to remind us that they are still here.

And then we cater to that. The media gives them infamy and endless attention for a short time while the situations are politically exploited.

One simple step I would think is to stop giving them the attention they are after. Stop inspiring the next shooter. Let them die nameless and their names forgotten

Yes, OFTEN these shootings are a way for those who feel worthless to feel important/powerful.
I agree with you that "we" cater to it.
I am torn about giving them attention. Hard to ignore when someone kills innocent people. Do the killers need to be identified? That's a tough one for me to answer.

[jfish26]

What these shootings truly are is a desperate cry for help. An act of vengeance and attention for these mentally unstable lost souls that feel they don't fit into society and want to remind us that they are still here.

And then we cater to that. The media gives them infamy and endless attention for a short time while the situations are politically exploited.

One simple step I would think is to stop giving them the attention they are after. Stop inspiring the next shooter. Let them die nameless and their names forgotten

One simple step to reduce the number of children turned into hamburger meat by AR-15s would be to make AR-15s harder to get.

How ignorant do you have to be to still think that someone that doesn't abide by already established far more serious laws, is going to abide by a new law

If life in jail for murder didn't deter them. How is your little baby hurdle going to change anything

And yet…

…in the US, higher gun deaths are correlated with looser gun laws.

…globally, the US (1) is NOT an outlier in incidence of mental health issues, and (2) is VERY MUCH an outlier in (a) laxity of gun laws, and (b) gun deaths.

[zsn]

I asked a question a few pages ago and didn’t receive an answer. Do the randys of the world believe that there are any limitations to the Second Amendment? Given that they don’t believe that there should be any restrictions on the purchase and possession of an AR-15, should I be able to freely purchase and walk around with a loaded grenade launcher? Why/why not?

Do tactical nuclear weapons qualify as “arms” under the Second Amendment? Is my inability to obtain one a violation of rights granted to me by the Constitution?

The Founding Fathers have been wrong about a few things when they framed the Constitution. Could they have possibly been erroneous with the Second Amendment also, along the lines of three-fifths people and women voting?

[jfish26]

I asked a question a few pages ago and didn’t receive an answer. Do the randys of the world believe that there are any limitations to the Second Amendment? Given that they don’t believe that there should be any restrictions on the purchase and possession of an AR-15, should I be able to freely purchase and walk around with a loaded grenade launcher? Why/why not?

Do tactical nuclear weapons qualify as “arms” under the Second Amendment? Is my inability to obtain one a violation of rights granted to me by the Constitution?

The Founding Fathers have been wrong about a few things when they framed the Constitution. Could they have possibly been erroneous with the Second Amendment also, along the lines of three-fifths people and women voting?

The federal assault weapons ban (in effect from 1994-2004) was challenged on Constitutional grounds a number of times…and those challenges never succeeded.

As mentioned elsewhere in this thread a number of times, there are MYRIAD laws and regulations that limit individual access to specified weapons or variants of weapons…and no one seems all that pissed off that you can’t legally hunt waterfowl with a shotgun that can hold more than three shells (for example).

The gun lobby has successfully terrified the rubes into believing that something fundamental to our democracy would simply BREAK if ordinary joes and janes would again be restricted from purchasing AR-15s.

And make no mistake about it: assault rifles simply ARE more dangerous to the public than handguns and hunting-type long guns. The quantity AND quality of the damage they can do is just of a different scale.

[RainbowsandUnicorns]

Give me one good reason why any citizen should be able to (and can) go to a "local" gun "dealership" and purchase an AR-15 to use and shoot innocent people.

[jfish26]

Give me one good reason why any citizen should be able to (and can) go to a "local" gun "dealership" and purchase an AR-15 to use and shoot innocent people.

Something something freedom from tyranny don't tread on me the British are coming the British are coming.

[Sparko]

When you are a rifle hammer, everything is oppression and percussion caps.