Re: COVID-19 numbers
Posted: Mon Jun 15, 2020 5:12 pm
who is "the media"?
Thinking about schools and colleges...
https://twitter.com/CT_Bergstrom/status ... Etfw">June
Except all those other countries are much closer to having fully open economies and not needing to make any restrictions because of the virus.HouseDivided wrote: ↑Mon Jun 15, 2020 2:59 pmYup. It is the acme of selfishness to want to make a living and not depend on the government to feed, clothe, and shelter us.jfish26 wrote: ↑Mon Jun 15, 2020 2:28 pm A monument to American selfishness, and the predictable result of leadership that made science take a backseat to wishcasting:
https://twitter.com/keithedwards/status ... 7110178816
My boss has a son who lives in Washington and has several grade school aged kids....they announced they're opening in the fall and all staff/students will wear masks 100% of the time....i honestly haven't decided what I will do with my 2 yet if IL goes a similar route. Can my soon to be 1st grader really wear a mask all day? Can my soon to be preschooler really wear a mask for the few hours 3 days a week he will be in preschool? Is it worth it? The older 1 I think can. And her school isn't huge, but its certainly not small...but the preschooler might just be better off staying home with my wife and/or mom. He will lose a little bit of socialization aspect, but learning wise he'd do just fine. I am tempted to wait (for both) a few weeks at the beginning just to see how it is playing out rather than let them be guinea pigs....even not counting asymptomatic spreaders, many parents still send sick kids to school all the time (im sure many don't have a choice, but still...), so I don't have a whole lot of faith in a portion of parents who already have proven to be careless about letting their kids infect others with whatever sickness.seahawk wrote: ↑Mon Jun 15, 2020 5:44 pm Thinking about schools and colleges...
https://twitter.com/CT_Bergstrom/status ... Etfw">June
People are going to get sick. It is a reality that will not be prevented by shutting things down. Data coming back is showing that the whole online school solution was a complete waste of time. You can't just not educate kids out of fear any more than you can shut down the economy out of fear. There are repercussions either way.IllinoisJayhawk wrote: ↑Mon Jun 15, 2020 5:54 pmMy boss has a son who lives in Washington and has several grade school aged kids....they announced they're opening in the fall and all staff/students will wear masks 100% of the time....i honestly haven't decided what I will do with my 2 yet if IL goes a similar route. Can my soon to be 1st grader really wear a mask all day? Can my soon to be preschooler really wear a mask for the few hours 3 days a week he will be in preschool? Is it worth it? The older 1 I think can. And her school isn't huge, but its certainly not small...but the preschooler might just be better off staying home with my wife and/or mom. He will lose a little bit of socialization aspect, but learning wise he'd do just fine. I am tempted to wait (for both) a few weeks at the beginning just to see how it is playing out rather than let them be guinea pigs....even not counting asymptomatic spreaders, many parents still send sick kids to school all the time (im sure many don't have a choice, but still...), so I don't have a whole lot of faith in a portion of parents who already have proven to be careless about letting their kids infect others with whatever sickness.seahawk wrote: ↑Mon Jun 15, 2020 5:44 pm Thinking about schools and colleges...
https://twitter.com/CT_Bergstrom/status ... Etfw">June
I can't imagine living in dorms for college aged kids right now and expecting them somehow not to have it spread like wildfire.
As always, I wonder how many of those cases are asymptomatic or mildly symptomatic. The NYT has an agenda to push, so they aren't going to mess with specifics like that. The numbers we should be concerned with are deaths and median age of deaths. The rest is just not that important.PhDhawk wrote: ↑Mon Jun 15, 2020 5:46 pmExcept all those other countries are much closer to having fully open economies and not needing to make any restrictions because of the virus.HouseDivided wrote: ↑Mon Jun 15, 2020 2:59 pmYup. It is the acme of selfishness to want to make a living and not depend on the government to feed, clothe, and shelter us.jfish26 wrote: ↑Mon Jun 15, 2020 2:28 pm A monument to American selfishness, and the predictable result of leadership that made science take a backseat to wishcasting:
https://twitter.com/keithedwards/status ... 7110178816
Maybe impatience is the better term than selfishness, but the point is we could have had a short period of strict shutdown or this long drawn out slow reopening.
This is like a bandaid that we're trying to take off on the worst way possible.
There are also countries that did not institute mandatory stay-at-home orders and their economies, like everyone else, still took a hit from the virus and are even giving out economic stimulus payments. The "sacrifice the economy for a select few" narrative here has been politically motivated bullshit from the beginning.PhDhawk wrote: ↑Mon Jun 15, 2020 5:46 pmExcept all those other countries are much closer to having fully open economies and not needing to make any restrictions because of the virus.HouseDivided wrote: ↑Mon Jun 15, 2020 2:59 pmYup. It is the acme of selfishness to want to make a living and not depend on the government to feed, clothe, and shelter us.jfish26 wrote: ↑Mon Jun 15, 2020 2:28 pm A monument to American selfishness, and the predictable result of leadership that made science take a backseat to wishcasting:
https://twitter.com/keithedwards/status ... 7110178816
Maybe impatience is the better term than selfishness, but the point is we could have had a short period of strict shutdown or this long drawn out slow reopening.
This is like a bandaid that we're trying to take off on the worst way possible.
On a large scale, i agree.HouseDivided wrote: ↑Mon Jun 15, 2020 5:57 pmPeople are going to get sick. It is a reality that will not be prevented by shutting things down. Data coming back is showing that the whole online school solution was a complete waste of time. You can't just not educate kids out of fear any more than you can shut down the economy out of fear. There are repercussions either way.IllinoisJayhawk wrote: ↑Mon Jun 15, 2020 5:54 pmMy boss has a son who lives in Washington and has several grade school aged kids....they announced they're opening in the fall and all staff/students will wear masks 100% of the time....i honestly haven't decided what I will do with my 2 yet if IL goes a similar route. Can my soon to be 1st grader really wear a mask all day? Can my soon to be preschooler really wear a mask for the few hours 3 days a week he will be in preschool? Is it worth it? The older 1 I think can. And her school isn't huge, but its certainly not small...but the preschooler might just be better off staying home with my wife and/or mom. He will lose a little bit of socialization aspect, but learning wise he'd do just fine. I am tempted to wait (for both) a few weeks at the beginning just to see how it is playing out rather than let them be guinea pigs....even not counting asymptomatic spreaders, many parents still send sick kids to school all the time (im sure many don't have a choice, but still...), so I don't have a whole lot of faith in a portion of parents who already have proven to be careless about letting their kids infect others with whatever sickness.seahawk wrote: ↑Mon Jun 15, 2020 5:44 pm Thinking about schools and colleges...
https://twitter.com/CT_Bergstrom/status ... Etfw">June
I can't imagine living in dorms for college aged kids right now and expecting them somehow not to have it spread like wildfire.
You’re fucking full of shit. An asymptomatic case for someone can be deadly for someone else.HouseDivided wrote: ↑Mon Jun 15, 2020 5:59 pmAs always, I wonder how many of those cases are asymptomatic or mildly symptomatic. The NYT has an agenda to push, so they aren't going to mess with specifics like that. The numbers we should be concerned with are deaths and median age of deaths. The rest is just not that important.PhDhawk wrote: ↑Mon Jun 15, 2020 5:46 pmExcept all those other countries are much closer to having fully open economies and not needing to make any restrictions because of the virus.HouseDivided wrote: ↑Mon Jun 15, 2020 2:59 pm
Yup. It is the acme of selfishness to want to make a living and not depend on the government to feed, clothe, and shelter us.
Maybe impatience is the better term than selfishness, but the point is we could have had a short period of strict shutdown or this long drawn out slow reopening.
This is like a bandaid that we're trying to take off on the worst way possible.
My 4 year olds pre school is in Dallas County at a church. He will start Kindergarten in Fall 2021. I’m hopeful he can catchup somehow this school year, but who knows what is going to happen come September.IllinoisJayhawk wrote: ↑Mon Jun 15, 2020 6:21 pmOn a large scale, i agree.HouseDivided wrote: ↑Mon Jun 15, 2020 5:57 pmPeople are going to get sick. It is a reality that will not be prevented by shutting things down. Data coming back is showing that the whole online school solution was a complete waste of time. You can't just not educate kids out of fear any more than you can shut down the economy out of fear. There are repercussions either way.IllinoisJayhawk wrote: ↑Mon Jun 15, 2020 5:54 pm
My boss has a son who lives in Washington and has several grade school aged kids....they announced they're opening in the fall and all staff/students will wear masks 100% of the time....i honestly haven't decided what I will do with my 2 yet if IL goes a similar route. Can my soon to be 1st grader really wear a mask all day? Can my soon to be preschooler really wear a mask for the few hours 3 days a week he will be in preschool? Is it worth it? The older 1 I think can. And her school isn't huge, but its certainly not small...but the preschooler might just be better off staying home with my wife and/or mom. He will lose a little bit of socialization aspect, but learning wise he'd do just fine. I am tempted to wait (for both) a few weeks at the beginning just to see how it is playing out rather than let them be guinea pigs....even not counting asymptomatic spreaders, many parents still send sick kids to school all the time (im sure many don't have a choice, but still...), so I don't have a whole lot of faith in a portion of parents who already have proven to be careless about letting their kids infect others with whatever sickness.
I can't imagine living in dorms for college aged kids right now and expecting them somehow not to have it spread like wildfire.
On the personal level, with a 1st grader (who is ahead of schedule on everything she was taught in kindergarten, largely because my wife and mom were able to care for her 100% of the time in her younger years...same with my younger 1) I am confident they can keep her at or above whatever learning level she would be at for 1st grade....were she older, I wouldn't feel that way....so in my personal situation I feel I can safely err on the side of extreme caution. Especially because she struggles far worse with respiratory infections than my younger one so far for whatever reason.....for the preschooler I'd like to get him in a classroom environment as early as possible because with 2 he obviously hasn't gotten quite as much 1 on 1 time as our first did....now, as a result, he excels at differnt things than she did at that age (physically speaking) because of his desire to keep up with his older sister. He can already count and do ABCs and all that preschool stuff they will teach him, but branching out would be good for him on other levels.
It is a tough spot....hopefully we make good progress on covid19 over the coming months and my decision is easier. My area still hasn't been hit as hard as some, and I'm definitely overly cautious when it comes to my kids...so there's that. If my area keeps being safe, maybe we can greatly reduce community to spread to a point where it is relatively safe to send them both without hesitation.
You’re choosing to be a dupe. That’s on you, not me.sdoyel wrote: ↑Mon Jun 15, 2020 10:06 pmYou’re fucking full of shit. An asymptomatic case for someone can be deadly for someone else.HouseDivided wrote: ↑Mon Jun 15, 2020 5:59 pmAs always, I wonder how many of those cases are asymptomatic or mildly symptomatic. The NYT has an agenda to push, so they aren't going to mess with specifics like that. The numbers we should be concerned with are deaths and median age of deaths. The rest is just not that important.PhDhawk wrote: ↑Mon Jun 15, 2020 5:46 pm
Except all those other countries are much closer to having fully open economies and not needing to make any restrictions because of the virus.
Maybe impatience is the better term than selfishness, but the point is we could have had a short period of strict shutdown or this long drawn out slow reopening.
This is like a bandaid that we're trying to take off on the worst way possible.
I’m tired of this fucking clown show on Capitol Hill and I’m tired of having to wear my mask around because of arrogant, entitled shit heads who don’t believe in science.
The science, three-plus months ago now, was that severe, collective economic/social pain for 3-4 weeks would have worked, and put us in a position to resume normal life by about now. That science is borne out by the results in countries that, you know, took that route.HouseDivided wrote: ↑Mon Jun 15, 2020 5:57 pmPeople are going to get sick. It is a reality that will not be prevented by shutting things down. Data coming back is showing that the whole online school solution was a complete waste of time. You can't just not educate kids out of fear any more than you can shut down the economy out of fear. There are repercussions either way.IllinoisJayhawk wrote: ↑Mon Jun 15, 2020 5:54 pmMy boss has a son who lives in Washington and has several grade school aged kids....they announced they're opening in the fall and all staff/students will wear masks 100% of the time....i honestly haven't decided what I will do with my 2 yet if IL goes a similar route. Can my soon to be 1st grader really wear a mask all day? Can my soon to be preschooler really wear a mask for the few hours 3 days a week he will be in preschool? Is it worth it? The older 1 I think can. And her school isn't huge, but its certainly not small...but the preschooler might just be better off staying home with my wife and/or mom. He will lose a little bit of socialization aspect, but learning wise he'd do just fine. I am tempted to wait (for both) a few weeks at the beginning just to see how it is playing out rather than let them be guinea pigs....even not counting asymptomatic spreaders, many parents still send sick kids to school all the time (im sure many don't have a choice, but still...), so I don't have a whole lot of faith in a portion of parents who already have proven to be careless about letting their kids infect others with whatever sickness.seahawk wrote: ↑Mon Jun 15, 2020 5:44 pm Thinking about schools and colleges...
https://twitter.com/CT_Bergstrom/status ... Etfw">June
I can't imagine living in dorms for college aged kids right now and expecting them somehow not to have it spread like wildfire.
Beijing says hello. And don't be a dupe.jfish26 wrote: ↑Tue Jun 16, 2020 8:33 amThe science, three-plus months ago now, was that severe, collective economic/social pain for 3-4 weeks would have worked, and put us in a position to resume normal life by about now. That science is borne out by the results in countries that, you know, took that route.HouseDivided wrote: ↑Mon Jun 15, 2020 5:57 pmPeople are going to get sick. It is a reality that will not be prevented by shutting things down. Data coming back is showing that the whole online school solution was a complete waste of time. You can't just not educate kids out of fear any more than you can shut down the economy out of fear. There are repercussions either way.IllinoisJayhawk wrote: ↑Mon Jun 15, 2020 5:54 pm
My boss has a son who lives in Washington and has several grade school aged kids....they announced they're opening in the fall and all staff/students will wear masks 100% of the time....i honestly haven't decided what I will do with my 2 yet if IL goes a similar route. Can my soon to be 1st grader really wear a mask all day? Can my soon to be preschooler really wear a mask for the few hours 3 days a week he will be in preschool? Is it worth it? The older 1 I think can. And her school isn't huge, but its certainly not small...but the preschooler might just be better off staying home with my wife and/or mom. He will lose a little bit of socialization aspect, but learning wise he'd do just fine. I am tempted to wait (for both) a few weeks at the beginning just to see how it is playing out rather than let them be guinea pigs....even not counting asymptomatic spreaders, many parents still send sick kids to school all the time (im sure many don't have a choice, but still...), so I don't have a whole lot of faith in a portion of parents who already have proven to be careless about letting their kids infect others with whatever sickness.
I can't imagine living in dorms for college aged kids right now and expecting them somehow not to have it spread like wildfire.
We had every opportunity to address this responsibly.
Instead, we have experienced the predictable results of some people caring and some people defying a physical virus out of ideological principal: we will have 3-4 quarters of severe economic pain - at least!
It's hard to be patient, we aren't a nation built for it. Immediate gratification is the current US model.HouseDivided wrote: ↑Mon Jun 15, 2020 2:59 pmYup. It is the acme of selfishness to want to make a living and not depend on the government to feed, clothe, and shelter us.jfish26 wrote: ↑Mon Jun 15, 2020 2:28 pm A monument to American selfishness, and the predictable result of leadership that made science take a backseat to wishcasting:
https://twitter.com/keithedwards/status ... 7110178816
There is nothing out there that supports your argument at all. This whole "it is inevitable" shtick is just the justification song of the selfish and impatient.HouseDivided wrote: ↑Mon Jun 15, 2020 5:57 pmPeople are going to get sick. It is a reality that will not be prevented by shutting things down. Data coming back is showing that the whole online school solution was a complete waste of time. You can't just not educate kids out of fear any more than you can shut down the economy out of fear. There are repercussions either way.IllinoisJayhawk wrote: ↑Mon Jun 15, 2020 5:54 pmMy boss has a son who lives in Washington and has several grade school aged kids....they announced they're opening in the fall and all staff/students will wear masks 100% of the time....i honestly haven't decided what I will do with my 2 yet if IL goes a similar route. Can my soon to be 1st grader really wear a mask all day? Can my soon to be preschooler really wear a mask for the few hours 3 days a week he will be in preschool? Is it worth it? The older 1 I think can. And her school isn't huge, but its certainly not small...but the preschooler might just be better off staying home with my wife and/or mom. He will lose a little bit of socialization aspect, but learning wise he'd do just fine. I am tempted to wait (for both) a few weeks at the beginning just to see how it is playing out rather than let them be guinea pigs....even not counting asymptomatic spreaders, many parents still send sick kids to school all the time (im sure many don't have a choice, but still...), so I don't have a whole lot of faith in a portion of parents who already have proven to be careless about letting their kids infect others with whatever sickness.seahawk wrote: ↑Mon Jun 15, 2020 5:44 pm Thinking about schools and colleges...
https://twitter.com/CT_Bergstrom/status ... Etfw">June
I can't imagine living in dorms for college aged kids right now and expecting them somehow not to have it spread like wildfire.