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Re: Punt the Big 12 Tourney Petition
Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2020 12:49 pm
by twocoach
NDballer13 wrote: ↑Thu Mar 05, 2020 11:05 am
twocoach wrote: ↑Thu Mar 05, 2020 10:57 am
Play hard.
Play to win.
Don't do half assed reps right before the tourney; now is the time to perfect the game.
You're missing the point. It's not about playing Dotson 30 minutes, instead of 37. It's about him not even playing at all. Same for Dok and Garrett.
I get if they were told playing on it won't make it worse, or whatever. But that doesn't mean it's getting better. Take the week. Rest and rehab. A game next Friday means as much to this team as an October game again Pitt State.
That isnt happening. Bill Self doesnt do that and I dont see him starting to do that. Fans do this same dance every year, mainly because they are freaked out about how good a shot the team has so they want them all wrapped in bubble wrap and stored away for the tourney.
Every game is a chance to get better and a chance to gain valuable experience and reps. View it as a chance to help prepare to win a national title instead of a chance to get injured and lose a national title and you'll live longer.
We have a maximum of 10 games left. I hope they play hard and win them all.
Re: Punt the Big 12 Tourney Petition
Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2020 12:56 pm
by twocoach
NewtonHawk11 wrote: ↑Thu Mar 05, 2020 12:41 pm
jfish26 wrote: ↑Thu Mar 05, 2020 11:15 am
CrimsonNBlue wrote: ↑Thu Mar 05, 2020 11:11 am
Well, there's former PG Braun. But, for me, I don't see the problem with running Jank out there and getting beat on Thursday or Friday.
Braun's not a backup if both Dot and Garrett are out. Shit, in that circumstance neither is Enaruna or McCormack. Might have to go two-big just to have five guys on the floor.
Not having even a Tharpe- or Moore-type shitbag on the roster has consequences.
Play Teahan. I actually think he's one of the highest quality walk-ons KU has had in a quite a while. 6'4 and can shoot. Don't think it'd hurt anything..
Lineup should be:
Braun, Moss, Enaruna, Ochai, Dave. Silvio, Teahan, Jank and Elliot off the bench.
Won't happen that way.
Self will play Dotson, Garrett and Dok all 20 minutes until NCAA tournament. Keep them fresh but not rusty.
And Dave and Silvio will play a shit ton.
That's hilarious. I'd be stunned if any of our regular starters plays less than 30 minutes in any game in KC, let alone sits out. If they play less than 30 in the first game it is because we kicked a team's ass and could play bench guys.
Re: Punt the Big 12 Tourney Petition
Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2020 12:59 pm
by NewtonHawk11
TwoCoach is right in a sense. Bill has never done that. But he also hasn't had many instances to where he has 3 of his top guys banged up with injuries.
His teams are mostly healthy entering March. This team is really not.
Re: Punt the Big 12 Tourney Petition
Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2020 1:04 pm
by NDballer13
twocoach wrote: ↑Thu Mar 05, 2020 12:49 pm
NDballer13 wrote: ↑Thu Mar 05, 2020 11:05 am
twocoach wrote: ↑Thu Mar 05, 2020 10:57 am
Play hard.
Play to win.
Don't do half assed reps right before the tourney; now is the time to perfect the game.
You're missing the point. It's not about playing Dotson 30 minutes, instead of 37. It's about him not even playing at all. Same for Dok and Garrett.
I get if they were told playing on it won't make it worse, or whatever. But that doesn't mean it's getting better. Take the week. Rest and rehab. A game next Friday means as much to this team as an October game again Pitt State.
That isnt happening. Bill Self doesnt do that and I dont see him starting to do that. Fans do this same dance every year, mainly because they are freaked out about how good a shot the team has so they want them all wrapped in bubble wrap and stored away for the tourney.
Every game is a chance to get better and a chance to gain valuable experience and reps. View it as a chance to help prepare to win a national title instead of a chance to get injured and lose a national title and you'll live longer.
We have a maximum of 10 games left. I hope they play hard and win them all.
He did it in 2018 with Dok.
I'm with you when it comes to resting healthy players. That's just not the case this year.
Re: Punt the Big 12 Tourney Petition
Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2020 1:08 pm
by jfish26
twocoach wrote: ↑Thu Mar 05, 2020 12:49 pm
NDballer13 wrote: ↑Thu Mar 05, 2020 11:05 am
twocoach wrote: ↑Thu Mar 05, 2020 10:57 am
Play hard.
Play to win.
Don't do half assed reps right before the tourney; now is the time to perfect the game.
You're missing the point. It's not about playing Dotson 30 minutes, instead of 37. It's about him not even playing at all. Same for Dok and Garrett.
I get if they were told playing on it won't make it worse, or whatever. But that doesn't mean it's getting better. Take the week. Rest and rehab. A game next Friday means as much to this team as an October game again Pitt State.
That isnt happening. Bill Self doesnt do that and I dont see him starting to do that. Fans do this same dance every year, mainly because they are freaked out about how good a shot the team has so they want them all wrapped in bubble wrap and stored away for the tourney.
Every game is a chance to get better and a chance to gain valuable experience and reps. View it as a chance to help prepare to win a national title instead of a chance to get injured and lose a national title and you'll live longer.
We have a maximum of 10 games left. I hope they play hard and win them all.
It's easy to say all of this, but don't you get a pit in your stomach in advance at the thought of, say, Doke breaking a wrist playing Oklahoma next Thursday?
The chances are small, but obviously not remote (especially when there's really three indispensable guys, each with history).
Re: Punt the Big 12 Tourney Petition
Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2020 1:14 pm
by MICHHAWK
That’s a risk every time the children take the floor.
I get the feeling some of you hope it happens so you can tell us “i told you so.”
Re: Punt the Big 12 Tourney Petition
Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2020 1:30 pm
by NDballer13
jfish26 wrote: ↑Thu Mar 05, 2020 1:08 pm
It's easy to say all of this, but don't you get a pit in your stomach in advance at the thought of, say, Doke breaking a wrist playing Oklahoma next Thursday?
The chances are small, but obviously not remote (especially when there's really three indispensable guys, each with history).
This is the part where it gets out of hand. There's a difference between resting Dok to let his ankle get as close to 100% as possible and resting him in fear of suffer a new injury.
Re: Punt the Big 12 Tourney Petition
Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2020 1:36 pm
by CrimsonNBlue
NewtonHawk11 wrote: ↑Thu Mar 05, 2020 12:59 pm
TwoCoach is right in a sense. Bill has never done that. But he also hasn't had many instances to where he has 3 of his top guys banged up with injuries.
His teams are mostly healthy entering March. This team is really not.
We punted in 2012, 2017, and 2018 at least. Just happened to win in 2018.
Re: Punt the Big 12 Tourney Petition
Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2020 1:39 pm
by NDballer13
Who sat out in 2012 to call that a punt?
Re: Punt the Big 12 Tourney Petition
Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2020 1:41 pm
by CrimsonNBlue
The whole team. Needed the rest.
Re: Punt the Big 12 Tourney Petition
Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2020 1:43 pm
by NDballer13
So now we're calling a loss to a Top 15 team a punt? Lol, every one of the starters played 32+ minutes in that loss to Baylor. If Dok, Dot, and Garrett all play 35-38 minutes and they lose to TT in the second round, is that a punt?
Re: Punt the Big 12 Tourney Petition
Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2020 1:51 pm
by twocoach
jfish26 wrote: ↑Thu Mar 05, 2020 1:08 pm
twocoach wrote: ↑Thu Mar 05, 2020 12:49 pm
NDballer13 wrote: ↑Thu Mar 05, 2020 11:05 am
You're missing the point. It's not about playing Dotson 30 minutes, instead of 37. It's about him not even playing at all. Same for Dok and Garrett.
I get if they were told playing on it won't make it worse, or whatever. But that doesn't mean it's getting better. Take the week. Rest and rehab. A game next Friday means as much to this team as an October game again Pitt State.
That isnt happening. Bill Self doesnt do that and I dont see him starting to do that. Fans do this same dance every year, mainly because they are freaked out about how good a shot the team has so they want them all wrapped in bubble wrap and stored away for the tourney.
Every game is a chance to get better and a chance to gain valuable experience and reps. View it as a chance to help prepare to win a national title instead of a chance to get injured and lose a national title and you'll live longer.
We have a maximum of 10 games left. I hope they play hard and win them all.
It's easy to say all of this, but don't you get a pit in your stomach in advance at the thought of, say, Doke breaking a wrist playing Oklahoma next Thursday?
The chances are small, but obviously not remote (especially when there's really three indispensable guys, each with history).
Dok two wrist injuries have both happened in practice, correct?
Should Self hold him out of practice?
At some some point, preventative steps such as this just prevent you from winning. If we are up 15 with 4 minutes left then put SFS in and let him finish it out and save a few reps. Outside of that...it's sports. Fluky things happen sometimes.
Re: Punt the Big 12 Tourney Petition
Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2020 1:52 pm
by pdub
MICHHAWK wrote: ↑Thu Mar 05, 2020 1:14 pm
That’s a risk every time the children take the floor.
I get the feeling some of you hope it happens so you can tell us “i told you so.”
'That’s a risk every time the children take the floor.'
A. Children? What's wrong with you?
B. Yes. But it's zero risk if the 'children' DON'T take the floor. And that's the point here.
'I get the feeling some of you hope it happens so you can tell us “i told you so.”'
Sofuckingdumb.
Re: Punt the Big 12 Tourney Petition
Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2020 1:53 pm
by CrimsonNBlue
I'm just not convinced that a team that was playing at a national championship level gave their all in a meaningless tournament. Avoiding another missouri game was great for that team.
I just don't buy that we've never punted this tourney when a mediocre program like Iowa State is winning the thing like 60% of the time when our big 12 finishes have been:
2, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 3, 1
Re: Punt the Big 12 Tourney Petition
Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2020 1:54 pm
by pdub
twocoach wrote: ↑Thu Mar 05, 2020 1:51 pm
Dok two wrist injuries have both happened in practice, correct?
Should Self hold him out of practice?
At some some point, preventative steps such as this just prevent you from winning. If we are up 15 with 4 minutes left then put SFS in and let him finish it out and save a few reps. Outside of that...it's sports. Fluky things happen sometimes.
But Self will know what kind of practices to run.
Flukes happen and you can't get rid of that chance.
But more injuries happen at full speed games because you are going all out than in a controlled practice ( despite the limited results we are linking Udoka to ).
Re: Punt the Big 12 Tourney Petition
Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2020 1:56 pm
by twocoach
CrimsonNBlue wrote: ↑Thu Mar 05, 2020 1:36 pm
NewtonHawk11 wrote: ↑Thu Mar 05, 2020 12:59 pm
TwoCoach is right in a sense. Bill has never done that. But he also hasn't had many instances to where he has 3 of his top guys banged up with injuries.
His teams are mostly healthy entering March. This team is really not.
We punted in 2012, 2017, and 2018 at least. Just happened to win in 2018.
What? In 2012, Kansas lost in the semis to Baylor after winning their first game.
Minutes by the starters in that game vs. Baylor:
Thomas Robinson- 33
Tyshawn Taylor- 40
Jeff Withey- 32
Travis Releford- 31
Elijah Johnson- 35
We didnt punt that year, we just went
2-13 from 3 while allowing Baylor to go 9-19.
Re: Punt the Big 12 Tourney Petition
Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2020 1:58 pm
by twocoach
pdub wrote: ↑Thu Mar 05, 2020 1:54 pm
twocoach wrote: ↑Thu Mar 05, 2020 1:51 pm
Dok two wrist injuries have both happened in practice, correct?
Should Self hold him out of practice?
At some some point, preventative steps such as this just prevent you from winning. If we are up 15 with 4 minutes left then put SFS in and let him finish it out and save a few reps. Outside of that...it's sports. Fluky things happen sometimes.
But Self will know what kind of practices to run.
Flukes happen and you can't get rid of that chance.
But more injuries happen at full speed games because you are going all out than in a controlled practice ( despite the limited results we are linking Udoka to ).
Are your hands getting all chapped from rubbing them together while fretting?
Saying that more injuries happen in games than in practice is purely a wild ass guess on your part. You have no idea if that is accurate or not.
Re: Punt the Big 12 Tourney Petition
Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2020 2:04 pm
by CrimsonNBlue
illy two.0
Re: Punt the Big 12 Tourney Petition
Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2020 2:07 pm
by TDub
twocoach wrote: ↑Thu Mar 05, 2020 1:51 pm
jfish26 wrote: ↑Thu Mar 05, 2020 1:08 pm
twocoach wrote: ↑Thu Mar 05, 2020 12:49 pm
That isnt happening. Bill Self doesnt do that and I dont see him starting to do that. Fans do this same dance every year, mainly because they are freaked out about how good a shot the team has so they want them all wrapped in bubble wrap and stored away for the tourney.
Every game is a chance to get better and a chance to gain valuable experience and reps. View it as a chance to help prepare to win a national title instead of a chance to get injured and lose a national title and you'll live longer.
We have a maximum of 10 games left. I hope they play hard and win them all.
It's easy to say all of this, but don't you get a pit in your stomach in advance at the thought of, say, Doke breaking a wrist playing Oklahoma next Thursday?
The chances are small, but obviously not remote (especially when there's really three indispensable guys, each with history).
Dok two wrist injuries have both happened in practice, correct?
Should Self hold him out of practice?
At some some point, preventative steps such as this just prevent you from winning. If we are up 15 with 4 minutes left then put SFS in and let him finish it out and save a few reps. Outside of that...it's sports. Fluky things happen sometimes.
I wish we would punt. I also agree with you that we wont and that its minimal risk for new injury. This is all about recovering from previous injuries.
Also i wouldnt put SFS in the game at all. That shits expensive and really when do you actually ever need anything surfaced on all 4 sides? One side is always down. Id go with SDS though.
Re: Punt the Big 12 Tourney Petition
Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2020 2:07 pm
by TDub
MICHHAWK wrote: ↑Thu Mar 05, 2020 1:14 pm
I get the feeling some of you hope it happens so you can tell us “i told you so.”
Take it to the poli bored