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Re: Our National Health Care Situation

Posted: Tue Nov 28, 2023 5:56 pm
by Sparko
Universal healthcare is a winning issue for everyone not voting for chainsaw wielding fascists

Re: Our National Health Care Situation

Posted: Tue Nov 28, 2023 6:08 pm
by ousdahl
KUTradition wrote: Tue Nov 28, 2023 2:34 pm
Back2Lawrence wrote: Tue Nov 28, 2023 2:25 pm
KUTradition wrote: Tue Nov 28, 2023 1:52 pm they at least would have tried
you are both wrong. it's just constant back and forth well yeah but your side nonsense anymore. Health care is so immense, though, everyone gets a piece of the pie.
what’s the ACA if not trying to remedy the problem?
Yet another bone thrown to capital, but at least with a cute name?

Wasn’t it like literally written by insurance companies. And shelved an actual universal/single payer option way early on. And sure I think it nixed shit like being dropped for pre-existing conditions, but hasn’t healthcare since the Affordable Care Act become much LESS affordable overall?

Not to mention the whole idea of a law mandating purchase of a free market private sector product.

Re: Our National Health Care Situation

Posted: Tue Nov 28, 2023 6:42 pm
by Overlander
ousdahl wrote: Tue Nov 28, 2023 6:08 pm
KUTradition wrote: Tue Nov 28, 2023 2:34 pm
Back2Lawrence wrote: Tue Nov 28, 2023 2:25 pm

you are both wrong. it's just constant back and forth well yeah but your side nonsense anymore. Health care is so immense, though, everyone gets a piece of the pie.
what’s the ACA if not trying to remedy the problem?
but hasn’t healthcare since the Affordable Care Act become much LESS affordable overall?
Name 1 thing that HASN'T become less affordable in that same time span?

Re: Our National Health Care Situation

Posted: Tue Nov 28, 2023 7:26 pm
by KUTradition
ousdahl wrote: Tue Nov 28, 2023 6:08 pm
KUTradition wrote: Tue Nov 28, 2023 2:34 pm
Back2Lawrence wrote: Tue Nov 28, 2023 2:25 pm

you are both wrong. it's just constant back and forth well yeah but your side nonsense anymore. Health care is so immense, though, everyone gets a piece of the pie.
what’s the ACA if not trying to remedy the problem?
Yet another bone thrown to capital, but at least with a cute name?

Wasn’t it like literally written by insurance companies. And shelved an actual universal/single payer option way early on. And sure I think it nixed shit like being dropped for pre-existing conditions, but hasn’t healthcare since the Affordable Care Act become much LESS affordable overall?

Not to mention the whole idea of a law mandating purchase of a free market private sector product.
i don’t know. go find the answer yourself

nobody said the efforts were perfect, just that one side was actually making an effort on the healthcare front

Re: Our National Health Care Situation

Posted: Wed Nov 29, 2023 7:17 pm
by DCHawk1
From the Satellite thread:
DCHawk1 wrote: Wed Nov 29, 2023 7:13 pm
TDub wrote: Tue Nov 28, 2023 5:00 pm I had terrific insurance when I was younger and never needed it. Now as a self employed person my insurance is expensive and it's crappy insurance.
So...I know this is an unpopular opinion 'round these parts, but the "A"CA is partly responsible for that.

Before the ACA (as the owner of two businesses but the only "employee" in my state), I bought family insurance on the open market. I had heart surgery in 2009 (and am still eternally grateful to Shirley for the reassurance he provided beforehand) and am, therefore, considered a "high-risk" insuree. I bought a normal family policy for Creamcheese and the kids and a high-risk-pool policy for myself. (38 states had high-risk pools available for people with preexisting conditions before ACA, narrative to the contrary). I paid about $500/month for all of them and about $750/month for myself, $1250 total. Not great, but not bad.

After ACA became law, its preexisting-condition provision ("community pricing") did NOT lower costs for people like me. Instead, it forced underwriters to treat EVERYONE as potentially high-risk. As a result, individual/family rates skyrocketed. Keeping the same coverage would have cost us around $4000/month (an increase of $2750/month, for those of you scoring at home).

Needless to say, we balked at that price. Creamcheese gave up her career as a mom and went back to working for other people, so we could have insurance that didn't cost us almost $50,000/year.

I'm not saying that our old system was great. But the ACA was a sop to the insurance companies and little more. Bipartisan Corporatism is the name of our political game.

Also, for the record, in 2008 John McCain proposed beginning the process of undoing the stupid war-era relic policy that tied health insurance to employment. He was roundly pilloried for doing by EVERYONE. Our health care system is indeed fucked up. The original sin in fucking it up, though, was the war-era policy of wage controls, which made health insurance a fringe benefit that employers could use to lure the best workers.

Re: Our National Health Care Situation

Posted: Wed Nov 29, 2023 8:43 pm
by Shirley
Not sure if this is the solution:

US health insurers Humana, Cigna in talks to merge

Nov 29 (Reuters) - U.S. health insurer Cigna (CI.N) is in talks to merge with peer Humana (HUM.N), a source familiar with the matter said on Wednesday, a deal that could exceed $60 billion in value and would be certain to attract fierce antitrust scrutiny.

The discussions come six years after regulators blocked mega-deals that would have consolidated the U.S. health insurance sector.

After U.S. courts upheld antitrust challenges in 2017, Cigna gave up on a $48 billion deal to acquire Anthem -- now known as Elevance Health. Losing the legal battle also caused Aetna -- now owned by pharmacy chain operator CVS Health (CVS.N) -- to abandon a $37 billion deal to acquire Humana.

[...]

Re: Our National Health Care Situation

Posted: Wed Nov 29, 2023 9:06 pm
by TDub
fairly certain is isnt

Re: Our National Health Care Situation

Posted: Wed Nov 29, 2023 9:10 pm
by Shirley
TDub wrote: Wed Nov 29, 2023 9:06 pm fairly certain is isnt
Consolidation resulting in fewer co.s selling health insurance would seem to be anti-competitive.

Re: Our National Health Care Situation

Posted: Wed Nov 29, 2023 9:19 pm
by TDub
Shirley wrote: Wed Nov 29, 2023 9:10 pm
TDub wrote: Wed Nov 29, 2023 9:06 pm fairly certain is isnt
Consolidation resulting in fewer co.s selling health insurance would seem to be anti-competitive.
good news they can raise costs even more! and provide less services!

sounds like our taxes. Love it.

Re: Our National Health Care Situation

Posted: Thu Nov 30, 2023 4:43 am
by Back2Lawrence
The airlines have successfully done this in the last 15 years. But, jobs!

Re: Our National Health Care Situation

Posted: Thu Nov 30, 2023 8:22 am
by TDub
we should've never bailed out the airlines. the global shipping needed to remain but we really don't need air travel at the expense of trillions in tax payer money.

If they failed....then fuck it, they fail. I can think of a million other things thay money shouldve or could've gone too.

Re: Our National Health Care Situation

Posted: Thu Nov 30, 2023 8:25 am
by ousdahl
Or, if we DO need air travel at the expense of trillions in tax payer money, then maybe we should just nationalize that shit

Re: Our National Health Care Situation

Posted: Thu Nov 30, 2023 8:26 am
by TDub
we don't...and absolutely not.

Nationalize air travel?

Absofuckinglutely No.

Re: Our National Health Care Situation

Posted: Thu Nov 30, 2023 8:28 am
by ousdahl
OK so let’s just keep subsidizing it while they keep cutting services, cutting wages, and buying back stocks. Yaaay invisible hands.

Re: Our National Health Care Situation

Posted: Thu Nov 30, 2023 8:30 am
by TDub
did I say I supported that? Pretty sure I just said that was dumb and we should've let them fail?

Re: Our National Health Care Situation

Posted: Thu Nov 30, 2023 8:31 am
by TDub
also, for a guy that has spent the last....year? railing against every facet of government and every decision the government has made.....

you sure are eager to hand them control over more and more things.

Re: Our National Health Care Situation

Posted: Thu Nov 30, 2023 8:33 am
by TDub
Air travel is a luxury and unnecessary.

It is not a necessity and it is not a human right.

Don't bail it out, don't subsidize it, don't artificially keep it afloat, and for fucks sake for sure don't nationalize it.

Re: Our National Health Care Situation

Posted: Thu Nov 30, 2023 8:36 am
by ousdahl
How about nationalizing healthcare, then?

Re: Our National Health Care Situation

Posted: Thu Nov 30, 2023 8:38 am
by TDub
Do you read anything posted or do you just post random shit then attempt spin things around into an I gotcha?

If you been reading and following along then you already have my answer.

Re: Our National Health Care Situation

Posted: Thu Nov 30, 2023 8:40 am
by ousdahl
TDub wrote: Thu Nov 30, 2023 8:31 am also, for a guy that has spent the last....year? railing against every facet of government and every decision the government has made.....

you sure are eager to hand them control over more and more things.
Well, a big reason I don’t trust the gummint much is because instead of the gummint making things like healthcare or transportation better for our nation, we put most of our resources toward bombs instead.