COVID-19 - On the Ground

[Deleted User 89]

It will be interesting to see how this place reacts when the proposed government control overreach and liberty forfeiture is from something they dont agree with.....

Wait, i feel like thats happened before.


Precedent. Is. Dangerous .


Also had no idea we had so many Duterte fans here. Dudes tough on choices. Thats for sure.

odd that you’d think the Philippines is an apt comparison here, but laughed off my comparison to South Africa in the water use discussion

[TDub]

It will be interesting to see how this place reacts when the proposed government control overreach and liberty forfeiture is from something they dont agree with.....

Wait, i feel like thats happened before.


Precedent. Is. Dangerous .


Also had no idea we had so many Duterte fans here. Dudes tough on choices. Thats for sure.

odd that you’d think the Philippines is an apt comparison here, but laughed off my comparison to South Africa in the water use discussion

Its an extreme example of draconian measures that many here would welcome with open arms. I dont think theyd agree with the other items he has control over, however.

[Deleted User 89]

It will be interesting to see how this place reacts when the proposed government control overreach and liberty forfeiture is from something they dont agree with.....

Wait, i feel like thats happened before.


Precedent. Is. Dangerous .


Also had no idea we had so many Duterte fans here. Dudes tough on choices. Thats for sure.

odd that you’d think the Philippines is an apt comparison here, but laughed off my comparison to South Africa in the water use discussion

Its an extreme example of draconian measures that many here would welcome with open arms. I dont think theyd agree with the other items he has control over, however.

yeah, i get why you’d use that example/comparison

i just think it’s much less apt than the one i used

the checks and balances, not to mention ngo watchdog groups, in the US make your comparison rather meaningless, imo

for all intents and purposes, Duterte is a dictator at the head of a pseudo-democracy

“that many here would welcome with open arms”...dramatic effect much?

[twocoach]

It will be interesting to see how this place reacts when the proposed government control overreach and liberty forfeiture is from something they dont agree with.....

Wait, i feel like thats happened before.


Precedent. Is. Dangerous .


Also had no idea we had so many Duterte fans here. Dudes tough on choices. Thats for sure.

odd that you’d think the Philippines is an apt comparison here, but laughed off my comparison to South Africa in the water use discussion

Its an extreme example of draconian measures that many here would welcome with open arms. I dont think theyd agree with the other items he has control over, however.

So a fear tactic to convince people not to fall prey to government fear tactics. Got it.

[TDub]

odd that you’d think the Philippines is an apt comparison here, but laughed off my comparison to South Africa in the water use discussion

Its an extreme example of draconian measures that many here would welcome with open arms. I dont think theyd agree with the other items he has control over, however.

yeah, i get why you’d use that example/comparison

i just think it’s much less apt than the one i used

the checks and balances, not to mention ngo watchdog groups, in the US make your comparison rather meaningless, imo

for all intents and purposes, Duterte is a dictator at the head of a pseudo-democracy

“that many here would welcome with open arms”...dramatic effect much?

Dramatic?.....have you seen the posts here?

[twocoach]

It will be interesting to see how this place reacts when the proposed government control overreach and liberty forfeiture is from something they dont agree with.....

Wait, i feel like thats happened before.


Precedent. Is. Dangerous .


Also had no idea we had so many Duterte fans here. Dudes tough on choices. Thats for sure.

odd that you’d think the Philippines is an apt comparison here, but laughed off my comparison to South Africa in the water use discussion

Its an extreme example of draconian measures that many here would welcome with open arms. I dont think theyd agree with the other items he has control over, however.

So you had tons of complaints about the Trump administrations destruction of so many checks and balances meant to give the people oversight into what the government is doing so that they don't have as much unchecked power, correct?

[Deleted User 89]

https://www.deseret.com/utah/2021/8/2/2 ... nt-covid19

i’d think anti-masking laws might fall under “inciting actions that would harm others”

[sdoyel]

Louisiana reinstates mask mandate in public places for those 5yrs of age and older.

https://twitter.com/louisianagov/status ... 68162?s=21

[MICHHAWK]

the only thing as dumb as anti masking laws are masking mandates.

[TDub]

odd that you’d think the Philippines is an apt comparison here, but laughed off my comparison to South Africa in the water use discussion

Its an extreme example of draconian measures that many here would welcome with open arms. I dont think theyd agree with the other items he has control over, however.

So you had tons of complaints about the Trump administrations destruction of so many checks and balances meant to give the people oversight into what the government is doing so that they don't have as much unchecked power, correct?

This is kinda my point. We had 400 pages of threads screaming about him being a dictator.......and now 400 pages of begging for dictatorish actions Its all a matter of perception.

Also, yes, i do not like anything that removes liberties from the people and adds the growing control of the govt.

[Leawood]

Some people need to read more about civil liberties. Those that think a federal, state, or local government can simply spy with impunity on someone's internet use (Facebook, etc.) forget about a little thing called "warrants" and the 4th Amendment. Similarly, federal, state, and local governments have this thing called "public health and safety" powers (read, vaccines) that folks must follow for the greater good. I suppose one can homeschool their kids to avoid polio vaccines and the like, but, if public health and safety requires it, then the government has the power to regulate. If one is unhappy with the exercise of that power, then there are these things called "courts" that can umpire such societal tensions, and there are plenty of "public interest" lawyers who do just that. On the other side of the coin, someone like the Missouri A.D. can file suit to stop mask mandates in Kansas City, except that the A.D. with his political stunt forgot that Kansas City is a constitution charter city under the Missouri Constitution. So good luck with that.

[Deleted User 863]

Still going off government mandate, then you run into the hypocrisy of abortion. The government shouldn't have a right to dictate your body choices. Before counter argument, you must at least understand, but not accept, that some think a life begins as soon as an egg is successfully fertilized. And thus if your argument is to protect other humans, an abortion to those that argue life begins at fertilization is a 100 percent death rate, while the odds of catching covid and then dying from it is give or take 600,000 divided by 350 some million.

I personally think its key to get vaccinated and also should be a womans right to choose...but there shouldn't be a mandate or enforcement of either.

Well said.

[Deleted User 89]

i don’t want to go off in a tangent here, but the idea that life begins at fertilization is...odd

why stop there? eggs and sperm are living prior to fertilization

imo, the question begins and ends with viability outside of the womb

[PhDhawk]

From 2011, but relevant:

https://www.npr.org/2011/04/05/13512145 ... tion-rules

[Deleted User 863]

What about people who don't get vaccinated for religious reasons? Hold them down and give them the shots anyway? Every year when we need a booster?

This is getting out of hand.

[PhDhawk]

i don’t want to go off in a tangent here, but the idea that life begins at fertilization is...odd

why stop there? eggs and sperm are living prior to fertilization

imo, the question begins and ends with viability outside of the womb

haploid cells don't replicate and become multicellular organisms. Zygotes do. A fertilized egg is a genetically distinct and unique organism.

[CrimsonNBlue]

What about people who don't get vaccinated for religious reasons? Hold them down and give them the shots anyway? Every year when we need a booster?

Ideally. But, I will probably have to settle for effectively banning them from most public places.

[Deleted User 863]

What about people who don't get vaccinated for religious reasons? Hold them down and give them the shots anyway? Every year when we need a booster?

Ideally. But, I will probably have to settle for effectively banning them from most public places.

If public places aren't safe then nobody should be in public places. If stopping the spread of the virus completely is the goal then we should all stay home. It's either okay to spread the virus or not. It can't be that it's okay for vaccinated people to spread the virus, but not okay for unvaccinated people to spread the virus.

[PhDhawk]

What about people who don't get vaccinated for religious reasons? Hold them down and give them the shots anyway? Every year when we need a booster?

This is getting out of hand.

40% of the population in this country isn't vaccinated.

99.9% of them don't have anything to do with their religion.

They're lazy, or they're dumb, or ill-informed, or they're scared of needles.

Let's not make martyrs out of them.

What's out of hand is the anti-vaccine hysteria, the anti-vaccine bullshit.

What we should be asking ourselves is, why was the polio vaccine effort so much better than the Covid19 vaccine effort, and the answer is pubic perception of the vaccine.

So, let's stop trying to demonize people who are supportive of the vaccine and recognize the problem are the people preventing others from getting it. The problem is the anti-vax campaigns and the misinformation and the divisiveness.

[Deleted User 89]

i don’t want to go off in a tangent here, but the idea that life begins at fertilization is...odd

why stop there? eggs and sperm are living prior to fertilization

imo, the question begins and ends with viability outside of the womb

haploid cells don't replicate and become multicellular organisms. Zygotes do. A fertilized egg is a genetically distinct and unique organism.

and?

life is life...or at least that seems to be the argument for when “life begins”